SPEAKER_03 0:01

All right. Here we are. It's September 7th, 2023. This is KJ. And Kate. And this is Hero. Or Dick. Your choice. Broadcasting from the bustling city of Alpina, Michigan.

SPEAKER_00 0:17

Alpina. It's not bustling today, but it has been. Yep. It has been. There was a music video recorded here or taped here.

SPEAKER_03 0:26

Tell the world about that.

SPEAKER_00 0:27

Um, I don't know. I just know you couldn't drive downtown because the bridge and everything was closed. You had to go around to Ninth Street.

SPEAKER_03 0:33

Was it an alternative music video?

SPEAKER_00 0:35

Uh, I don't know. I think it was a country.

SPEAKER_03 0:39

Not hip-hop.

SPEAKER_00 0:40

No, it was, but it was a country remake of a Brian Setzer song.

SPEAKER_03 0:44

Brian Setzer.

SPEAKER_00 0:46

Yeah, Brian Setzer Orchestra. Yeah, wasn't it uh so it's a country guy Brendan Mack.

SPEAKER_03 0:53

Is that his real last? I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 0:55

That's a stage.

SPEAKER_03 0:56

Is it Brendan Johnson or something?

SPEAKER_00 0:58

Maybe. Uh we really should know this at Salpina, Michigan, but we don't know.

SPEAKER_03 1:01

We should. I think he's my age.

SPEAKER_00 1:03

Uh he is maybe about there. Oh, see, I thought he was a little bit younger, but thanks. Not that you're old, just that that guy's young.

SPEAKER_03 1:12

Right, right.

SPEAKER_00 1:14

So anyway, he was he did that over Labor Day, so that's kind of cool.

SPEAKER_03 1:20

Yeah, I I saw somebody post somewhere about that. Oh no, it wasn't on the news. I don't know. Wherever. I don't watch the news so good.

SPEAKER_00 1:28

And the cruise ship was in a couple times.

SPEAKER_03 1:31

Um you know the schedule.

SPEAKER_00 1:34

Well, I see them out like backyard in my front yard.

SPEAKER_03 1:37

Why didn't I put that together?

SPEAKER_00 1:38

Today there must be some kind of bass tournament because there has been six bass boats, and they are so distinctive. You know, they're a low flat boat that you can stand up on, and they must cost a gazillion dollars because they're just have all kinds of stuff on them. They're expensive, and there it was six of them in front of our house. Or there's five in front of our house. When I went further on my way into town through Isaacson's Bay, there were six out in the bay. So there must be some kind of tournament. Good fishing. Or they just all call each other, hey, meet me.

SPEAKER_03 2:10

Yeah, let's hang out.

SPEAKER_00 2:11

Well, they weren't catching anything, but they were floating by. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:15

Did they race to their spots? Did you notice those guys?

SPEAKER_00 2:18

No, it didn't seem like there was a uh but you know, I wouldn't be I I can't see where I can't see the place where they would have uh a shotgun start. You know, that's beyond a couple points.

SPEAKER_03 2:33

I like that you just said shotgun start.

SPEAKER_00 2:35

Shotgun start.

SPEAKER_03 2:36

That's you can ride shotgun.

SPEAKER_00 2:38

You can.

SPEAKER_03 2:39

You can own a shotgun. Well, so you can shotgun a beer or a soda.

SPEAKER_00 2:44

It's a many use word.

SPEAKER_03 2:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 2:46

Maybe that should be like our topic.

SPEAKER_03 2:48

No, our topic should be uh the severe injury that you incurred.

SPEAKER_00 2:52

Oh, why we're two days late. I had a yoga injury, everything's fine, but somehow, you know, yoga is yoga, and you think, oh yoga, I'll just crank out these moves. But I accidentally elbowed myself in my own ribs.

SPEAKER_03 3:09

Was there a goat involved? Was it goat yoga?

SPEAKER_00 3:12

It was not goat yogurt, yoga yogurt.

SPEAKER_03 3:15

That's Greek yogurt.

SPEAKER_00 3:16

That's two different things.

SPEAKER_03 3:17

Wait, is there goat yogurt?

SPEAKER_00 3:19

Probably. Goat milk yogurt. Do you like goat milk? Oh, I know I hate it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:23

Goat cheese. It's pretty good. No, thank you. Okay. Well, back to the injury.

SPEAKER_00 3:27

So anyway, but I'm uh so the ribs were very sore, but they're fine.

SPEAKER_03 3:32

Ribs are a funny thing.

SPEAKER_00 3:34

Yeah. You can't really do anything.

SPEAKER_03 3:36

You must have really banged yourself.

SPEAKER_00 3:38

I elbowed myself. I was doing the um the pose is called something lizard, leaping lizard or something like that.

SPEAKER_03 3:45

Leaping lizard.

SPEAKER_00 3:46

That's not what it's called, but it's got the word lizard in it. And uh, I didn't even hold it for the whole minute. I was like halfway out, I'm tapping out, and I uh when I went to roll over, I elbowed myself in the ribs so hard that I like and cried out in such pain that my husband said, Should I do something? I'm like, no, I'm gonna be okay. I just let me yell it out here.

SPEAKER_03 4:11

So you're done with yoga now.

SPEAKER_00 4:13

No, no, I actually finished the session and I did it yesterday and today too.

SPEAKER_03 4:17

Is this new?

SPEAKER_00 4:18

No, I mean new in a few months, like six months.

SPEAKER_03 4:22

You got a good spot out there. You could go out on the document.

SPEAKER_00 4:24

I don't like doing it in public. I don't go to classes. Nobody needs to see me doing yoga. It's not pretty, it's never gonna be pretty, and I'm not gonna make people look at that. That's the way I think it's gyms in general. Uh yeah, I agree. But uh I will say it's giving me better balance, and that's all I was looking for. Yeah, when you walk, who is that? I didn't even fall down. Yeah. But I was holding my ribs, that's why.

SPEAKER_03 4:50

Yeah. It's hard to breathe, I bet.

SPEAKER_00 4:53

Uh no, it was the first day it kind of hurt. And then you know, you forget and you start doing something like, oh yeah, I forgot.

unknown 5:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:01

Forgot I'm old. So we actually do have a specific topic today for hero or day.

SPEAKER_03 5:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:10

And it's not shotgun, and it's not yoga, not goats, and it's not yogurt. It is. You want to tell the people what it is?

SPEAKER_03 5:18

Sure.

SPEAKER_00 5:19

What it is.

SPEAKER_03 5:21

P. T. Barnum.

SPEAKER_00 5:23

That guy. Yeah, he's a unique. Yes. He's he is the greatest showman on earth. Or he was in his day. In his day. He definitely knew how to self-promote.

SPEAKER_03 5:41

Self-promote. Exploit.

SPEAKER_00 5:43

And exploit and promote other people. Make money. He did have many occupations too. I mean, it took him a while. He was a while. It took him a while. He was a mayor. He was uh uh what else did he do? He had a weekly newspaper, he ran a general store, bought some real estate, had a little real estate stuff going on. But what what it what he's famous for is the Barnum and Bailey Circus.

SPEAKER_03 6:13

Which oddly enough didn't come until in his 60s.

SPEAKER_00 6:16

After yeah, after he was six years old.

SPEAKER_03 6:20

Talking guy.

SPEAKER_00 6:21

Which is good for him. How old was he when he died?

SPEAKER_03 6:24

Uh 80 something or another. So eighty one.

SPEAKER_00 6:27

So he was able to um enjoy his uh success as a circus promoter.

SPEAKER_03 6:36

Yeah, we got all the facts of whatever we can talk about, but you know, it's he's I like okay, I like some parts, I don't like some parts. I'm fascinated by the the fact that he was very creative. He was an entrepreneur, he never gave up, he kept trucking. I mean, he was pretty creative in the way that he went about making money. Um, and if you hit a hit a wall, you just go around it.

SPEAKER_00 7:01

You just go around it or find a way to exploit that. Yeah, a wall? Oh, okay. Well, it's a wall from the wall of China, yes. Yep, thank you. Yeah, but um but i I thought it was really interesting too, all his freak acts that he had. And yes, he exploited them, but um, so then you have to look at it two different ways, as with many things. So was he exploiting these people who were disabled or you know, uh a minority, or had some kind of um not normalcy to the public, or was he giving them a job? What would they do otherwise?

SPEAKER_03 7:47

Mm-hmm. And let's be honest, back in the day, some of those folks would never see the light of day. They'd be locked up in the attic.

SPEAKER_02 7:56

Right.

SPEAKER_03 7:57

And they'd find their bones years later.

SPEAKER_02 7:59

Dead. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 8:00

And so I don't know, it's tough because he knew what he was doing. He's no fucking dummy.

SPEAKER_00 8:07

He did. So a good example is the first person that he exploited that he said this woman is uh 161-year-old. 66. 166?

SPEAKER_03 8:17

Even older.

SPEAKER_00 8:18

Oh, well, that's believable then.

SPEAKER_03 8:19

Yeah, yeah, to add those five years on it makes a difference.

SPEAKER_00 8:22

It does. Who this poor woman was a slave. Joyce. He actually, yeah, say her name. What's the name?

SPEAKER_03 8:29

Hef. Oh Joyce. I love the way that it's spelled. J O I C E. And then the last name I got was H-E-T-H.

SPEAKER_00 8:39

Yeah. Joyce. Who is just a uh uh not just, but is uh a woman who is not 161 years old. Never mind, you're right. It is 161. I apologize. She is pretty old.

SPEAKER_03 8:52

I was trying to sell more tickets.

SPEAKER_00 8:54

You're doing that promotion.

SPEAKER_03 8:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:56

Um she is old, but she's not that old. But he promoted her as George Washington's slave, and she was the slave of somebody, and he actually rented her.

unknown 9:08

He I yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:08

First, he rented her. Maybe it was a rent that should be buying a thousand bucks, but he did, he rented her, which right there.

SPEAKER_03 9:17

Yeah, and kept her till she was too old.

SPEAKER_00 9:20

And did he give her any of his profits?

unknown 9:22

Probably not.

SPEAKER_03 9:23

I suspect no. I'm guessing no. You know what he did do for her though?

SPEAKER_00 9:26

What?

SPEAKER_03 9:26

To help her make make it more believable, I had her teeth pulled.

SPEAKER_00 9:31

Oh.

unknown 9:32

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 9:32

That's not cool.

SPEAKER_03 9:34

Nope.

SPEAKER_00 9:35

Huh. I didn't read that. Yeah, don't go down. I wish I wouldn't know that.

SPEAKER_03 9:39

Don't go down the dark hole of PT Barman. Barnum.

SPEAKER_00 9:42

But that okay, so here's some of his other ones. Uh the Fiji mermaid, which is actually a beautiful woman.

SPEAKER_03 9:52

No, it was a monkey head on a fish carcass, wasn't it?

SPEAKER_00 9:55

Yeah, it was a fish stitched to a monkey. Fucking people. What if they, you know. And then people went, oh yeah, that's the thing. Yeah. Yeah. Fiji.

SPEAKER_02 10:03

Ooh. Ooh, have you been there?

SPEAKER_00 10:05

Okay. Um, I did like the Frank Latini. He had three legs. You can't, I mean, you can't fake that.

SPEAKER_02 10:13

You can.

SPEAKER_00 10:14

You can, but he wasn't faking it.

SPEAKER_02 10:16

Right.

SPEAKER_00 10:16

He was four feet, he had four feet, which I don't get this. He had three legs, but it said he had four feet, which I'd have to see a picture of that, but I don't know if I want to.

SPEAKER_02 10:24

No.

SPEAKER_00 10:25

He had um 16 toes out of all the feet, and he had two sets of genitalia. No shit. I don't have that.

SPEAKER_03 10:35

That would keep a guy busy.

SPEAKER_00 10:36

I don't have a picture of that. Uh, so that was one of his oddities that he promoted. I don't think he was showing his junk to everybody, but well, maybe for a little extra. Oh, maybe.

SPEAKER_03 10:47

Maybe maybe he got to keep that money. Maybe that was his behind the curtain show.

SPEAKER_00 10:53

It probably was. I mean, how do we know?

SPEAKER_03 10:56

How do we how so what goes on in those things, those things?

SPEAKER_00 10:59

No. So another person was Kate Brumbeck, who had exceptional strength. She just threw people around because she was really, really strong.

SPEAKER_03 11:07

Her name was Kate? Yeah. You're you have an exceptional amount of strength as well.

SPEAKER_00 11:10

Well, I did till I did that yoga injury. No, I've lost it.

SPEAKER_03 11:13

You'll be all right.

SPEAKER_00 11:14

Um, Annie Jones was another person. She had a heavy beard and long hair. Her hair was six feet long. She works. She she does. That's the thing. Uh how about Isaac Sprague? He was extraordinarily lean. Oh, versus the fat lady. Wasn't that the same thing? He was the lean, yeah. So he was 5'6 and he weighed 43 pounds.

SPEAKER_03 11:41

Just moans.

SPEAKER_00 11:42

Yeah. He was really late. He was Holocaust before Holocaust was yeah, but he was cold all the time. And then my favorite guy is Randian. You know, there's nothing wrong with being different. No. That my favorite guy is Prince Ran Randian. He his thing was he was limbless. No limbs. No limbs. Limbs being arms and legs. I don't know about Jonatalia. Is that a limb? I don't know. And he's always wrapped up. He kind of they called him the uh cat caterpillar man or the worm man because he was always kind of you know bundled up. But he could roll a cigarette. That right there, friend. That's the talent. And so I hope he made money on his own. I don't know, but he was uh He should have had his own cigarette company. And he was uh he and a couple of uh other people that were in Barnum's uh what called P. T. Barnum's Grand Traveling Museum, Menagerie, Caravan, and Hippodrome were also in the movie Freaks. And that um that Prince Randian was in the movie Freaks.

SPEAKER_03 13:02

Prince Randiam is the worm.

SPEAKER_00 13:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 13:05

Was he why was why was he called a Prince?

SPEAKER_00 13:09

Well, I don't know. He was probably a prince from oh, I don't know. He was from a different country, so maybe he was a prince there.

SPEAKER_03 13:16

Maybe his name was just Prince.

SPEAKER_00 13:17

Maybe, maybe, formerly known as the worm.

SPEAKER_03 13:21

I don't know. You didn't t you didn't mention the famous one yet, the big one.

SPEAKER_00 13:26

Tom Thom.

SPEAKER_03 13:27

The big little one, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:28

Tom Thom.

SPEAKER_03 13:29

That was creepy.

SPEAKER_00 13:30

It was, um he was a kid. He was so, but he even when he grew up, he was still small.

SPEAKER_03 13:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:39

It was he was a kid to begin with.

SPEAKER_03 13:42

He uh acquired him right when he was four.

SPEAKER_00 13:45

That means he bought him.

SPEAKER_03 13:46

He made a deal with the parents to forge his age to say he was like 11, which would do. But by the time the kid was six, he was smoking and drinking as part of the act of being general telephone.

SPEAKER_00 13:57

Well, it was the 1800s. Cigarettes didn't give you cancer, though.

SPEAKER_03 14:01

No, they were vitamins, nutrients.

SPEAKER_00 14:03

They were by yeah, doctors promoted them. Yes, smoke this is good for your lungs.

SPEAKER_03 14:08

I bet you if people smoked more, the world would be a lot better.

SPEAKER_00 14:12

Well, 1800, look at all, you know, what was the life expectancy then versus now? Yeah, it's probably not that long to have a difference.

SPEAKER_03 14:20

You know, he went on to have his own career afterwards, didn't he?

SPEAKER_00 14:23

Yeah, he was in movies and stuff. You couldn't stop it. How how how big did he he he didn't grow up to be big?

SPEAKER_02 14:32

No, he was always small.

SPEAKER_00 14:33

He was still a midget, even though he was older.

SPEAKER_03 14:37

Yeah. He's always little.

SPEAKER_00 14:39

And didn't he marry a little person?

SPEAKER_03 14:41

He did. It was so cute. I saw the pictures.

SPEAKER_00 14:43

So cute.

SPEAKER_03 14:44

Two little weird-looking bowels.

SPEAKER_00 14:46

Oh, they look that's what they look like dolls.

SPEAKER_03 14:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 14:49

But you know what?

SPEAKER_03 14:50

We're weird looking compared. They're probably looking at us ain't.

SPEAKER_00 14:54

Look at those big monsters. They look horrible. Yeah. Mm-hmm. So, yeah, that's some of his people that he exploited, promoted, helped, hurt. Depends on who you ask, I guess.

SPEAKER_03 15:07

He helped that uh Jerry Jenny.

SPEAKER_00 15:10

Oh, yeah, the opera singer. Yeah. Jenny Lind.

SPEAKER_03 15:14

Jenny Lind. She was a Swedish opera singer.

SPEAKER_00 15:17

He had a crush on her.

SPEAKER_03 15:18

I don't know why, but well, her voice. She sang incredibly.

SPEAKER_00 15:23

If you like opera.

SPEAKER_03 15:24

If you do. Who was the one? I don't know if it was her, but anyway, one of his shows or his circus, whatever it was. I I just the numbers were staggering. Like 80 million visitors or something like that? At 25 cents a pop over. That's a lot. That's a pretty good chunk of change.

SPEAKER_00 15:44

And um one thing he did at his um, I don't uh I don't know if it was the traveling show or his museum that was um uh where was it in New York?

SPEAKER_02 15:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:59

He put a sign saying this way to the egress, knowing that not many people knew egress was the exit, and they go, Oh, yeah, let's go to the egress. And they'd get out and you couldn't get back in, you'd have to pay. You'd have to go around and pay your 25 cents again.

SPEAKER_03 16:17

Now, this plays into what I really think of this guy. That is that genius or evil. He's smart enough to know that people aren't that smart. And so he can take advantage of them, feed them bubble crap, exploit them. So, does that say that he's bad or people are bad because they're not educating themselves? Well, some people just don't know. Like he really took advantage of people.

SPEAKER_00 16:42

Yes, he did. Um, not just everyone does. Not just the freaks, not just the people in the show that he exploited, but his customers by saying this way to the egress. And then they because he knew they wouldn't know what that meant. He is also some of his credited quotes, no such thing as bad publicity.

SPEAKER_03 17:04

Doesn't sound like anybody else, I know.

SPEAKER_00 17:06

No, nobody. So many. Uh, ladies and gentlemen and children of all ages. That's a great quote.

SPEAKER_02 17:14

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 17:15

That gets used and used and used, and that's okay. And he is also credited with saying, let's get the show on the road.

unknown 17:24

Come on.

SPEAKER_03 17:25

He is?

SPEAKER_00 17:26

That's what uh I read it on the internet, so it must be true. But he did not actually say his famous quote that well the greatest show on No, the famous quote that he is always quoted as saying uh every source says no he didn't. There's a sucker born every minute.

SPEAKER_03 17:45

Oh yeah, that's right.

SPEAKER_00 17:47

Which he gets credit for, but he's he never said it.

SPEAKER_03 17:50

He might as well get it.

SPEAKER_00 17:51

But he he lived it.

SPEAKER_03 17:54

And then he supposedly changed as he got older. He went from he changed his, but he went ran for uh office so that he could uh promote uh the validity of the 13th Amendment to abolish slavery, supposedly. Yes. Well he did that.

SPEAKER_00 18:09

He was a pro he started as a pro-slavery Democrat, actually, then became a supporter of civil rights, Republican. He also was a a drinker, but then became a supporter of the temperance movement.

SPEAKER_03 18:25

Which that's cool. He changed.

SPEAKER_00 18:28

Well, or did he? Or did he? His politics and his personal promotions kind of seem to sway whatever way the crowd is going. So, oh yeah, people like temperance. I think I'll like that too. Yeah, that's what I do.

SPEAKER_02 18:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:48

So is he swaying for public approval or is he actually a changed person?

SPEAKER_03 18:53

Probably chasing the dollar.

SPEAKER_00 18:55

Probably a little above.

SPEAKER_03 18:56

I don't know, though. I shouldn't say that.

SPEAKER_00 18:58

I don't know. I don't know. It's pretty wishy-washy of him, I think.

SPEAKER_03 19:02

I do want to get deeper into people can change.

SPEAKER_00 19:05

People can change, and you I don't want to take that away from people. Everybody should change. Good god. If everybody stayed the same, it'd be horrible. Stinky. That'd be really bad.

SPEAKER_03 19:14

Um I do want to dig deeper on my own into the circus and maybe read a book or two about this dude. I did see that there's some disagreement on Hugh Jackman's portrayal, and that it's supposedly not.

SPEAKER_00 19:34

Well, I think they fluffed it up for the movie.

SPEAKER_03 19:36

Do the movies do that?

SPEAKER_00 19:37

Oh my gosh, do they? I don't think so. No, no, they tell it like it is. Nobody gets a happy ending.

SPEAKER_03 19:44

Got that writer's strike coming though. Or is it in a factory?

SPEAKER_00 19:47

It's still going on hundreds of days into it, like hundred and something. And we're not gonna we don't see the effect of it right now. But will you want to watch a movie? Sorry. Yeah. Yeah, I wish I would go back to work.

SPEAKER_03 20:06

Yeah. But well, you stay busy. You don't need movies.

SPEAKER_00 20:10

Um, I can read books.

SPEAKER_03 20:12

I like books. You should write a book.

SPEAKER_00 20:14

You should maybe I will.

SPEAKER_03 20:15

You know what you should do is maybe think of uh starting a small press.

SPEAKER_00 20:19

Oh, that's a great idea. Okay. Let it let us know, people, if yeah, there's any names or for a small press or any material.

SPEAKER_03 20:29

Yeah, they could email it to us, like all the fan mail we've been getting.

SPEAKER_00 20:32

Yeah, yeah. What's our email address?

SPEAKER_03 20:35

Hero or dick2023 at gmail.com.

SPEAKER_00 20:39

Very good. That's it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 20:41

Well, I'm in it every day reading people, right?

SPEAKER_00 20:44

I checked it and no, we didn't get it.

SPEAKER_03 20:46

I deleted them. There was someone that made me very angry.

SPEAKER_00 20:51

I would love to get one that made me angry. That would be okay too.

SPEAKER_03 20:55

I'll write one to you. You write one to me.

SPEAKER_00 20:57

Then we'll have two.

SPEAKER_03 20:58

Yep. So back to PT Barnett.

SPEAKER_00 21:01

So PT, yeah, what else do we want to say about him? I did see where he was kind of uh uh didn't like Jewish people. But I I didn't read deep into that because and not because I uh don't want to know, but because it seems like everybody before 1900s or even 1942, let's say, or 1940 before World War II, many people didn't like Jewish people. For what reason? I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 21:34

Right.

SPEAKER_00 21:35

I don't know. It's just a religion.

SPEAKER_03 21:38

Right. Why doesn't anybody like anybody, you know?

SPEAKER_00 21:42

Because of religion.

SPEAKER_03 21:43

You shouldn't just not like people because they're dicks.

SPEAKER_00 21:46

Well, that's true. And just because you're, you know one religion or another dick doesn't exonerate you from being a dick or not being a dick.

SPEAKER_03 21:56

No.

SPEAKER_00 21:57

There's assholes in every religion.

SPEAKER_03 21:59

Yep. And every of every color, every sexual orientation, every shape. True. Assholes are across the board. Yep.

SPEAKER_00 22:09

But P. T. Burnham, what were you gonna say about his looks? He looked apart.

SPEAKER_03 22:13

Yeah, he did. He looked like, you know, he'd be that kind of guy.

SPEAKER_00 22:16

Yeah. Yeah. When he walked into a room, I bet people went, there he is.

SPEAKER_03 22:19

There he is. There's P.

SPEAKER_00 22:21

T. What was his name? Phineas?

SPEAKER_03 22:23

Phineas something or not.

SPEAKER_00 22:25

Theodore Taylor. Phineas Taylor.

SPEAKER_03 22:31

Phineas. The grandmaster of show business.

SPEAKER_00 22:33

Who names the baby Phineas?

SPEAKER_03 22:36

His dad was a hustler.

SPEAKER_00 22:38

Oh, was he? I didn't read anything about his parents. Where did he come from?

SPEAKER_03 22:42

Two people. I don't know. I didn't really do that much, but I know that the little I did hear is like the guy, no matter what, he did whatever he had to do to make sure his family was, you know, taken care of.

SPEAKER_00 22:53

Sounds like PT did that too.

SPEAKER_03 22:55

PT went above and beyond.

SPEAKER_00 22:57

He did.

SPEAKER_03 22:57

He was like, fuck it. I am gonna do whatever it takes to make as much money as I can. And if it means pulling out some lady's teeth.

SPEAKER_00 23:05

And he did it.

SPEAKER_03 23:06

161 and she's really 80.

SPEAKER_00 23:09

Which is bad enough. I mean, old enough. And then in that time, 80 was like 100 and something.

SPEAKER_03 23:16

What about jumbo?

SPEAKER_00 23:17

Oh, the elephant?

SPEAKER_03 23:20

What was a big elephant?

SPEAKER_00 23:21

Well, it's jumbo. You don't get that name for nothing.

SPEAKER_03 23:24

Fed it like alcohol to keep it docile.

SPEAKER_00 23:29

So you would think that would be the opposite effect.

SPEAKER_03 23:31

Yeah, I don't know. I guess it depends on how much you give them. Who knows if that was true? That's one of the things I found.

SPEAKER_00 23:38

Jumbo. So what's your overall opinion?

SPEAKER_03 23:43

On jumbo?

SPEAKER_00 23:44

No, on PT.

SPEAKER_03 23:46

PT Barnum.

SPEAKER_00 23:47

Jumbo can be a different top.

SPEAKER_03 23:49

Gosh, you know, people when I was reading and watching, they're saying, you know, he well, he's just a product of his time. We are too. We're sitting here right now, and I guarantee it, 30 years from now, someone's gonna look back and call us names for something we've done, the way we look. Oh, probably. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_00 24:04

Probably. Yeah, that's true. So can you believe how politically incorrect they were?

SPEAKER_03 24:09

Yeah. We're talking about ribs and yoga?

SPEAKER_00 24:13

You can't talk like that. Crazy.

SPEAKER_03 24:16

Um this is a tough one for me because I'm not sure. It's kind of heroic what he did. But he became a hero by being a dick.

SPEAKER_00 24:29

Oh, that's very deep.

SPEAKER_03 24:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:32

I kind of have the same opinion though, too. I think you could argue that he gave jobs to people, freaks.

SPEAKER_03 24:41

I didn't read anywhere that he made people stay in the circus.

SPEAKER_00 24:43

No. Uh yeah, I don't know to how forceful he was. Um, and those people wouldn't have had anything else otherwise. How they were compensated, I don't know. Maybe, you know, did they get fairly compensated? Uh I'm not sure. So, did he give them jobs? Uh people who wouldn't have had anything otherwise, or did he exploit those who couldn't fight back? So I think he was really wishy-washy about that, too. Um, about uh, you know, he kind of swayed, like we said, with public opinion.

SPEAKER_02 25:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:18

So he became the guy the public wanted him to be. So he could profit from it. So usually we come to the conclusion, or typically we can come to the conclusion that a person's a hero, but they had some dickish moves. And I think, like you said, this is the opposite. I think he's a dick with some hero moves. Yeah. So that's what I think of B. T. Bard.

SPEAKER_03 25:45

I kind of like that better. He's a dick with hero moves.

SPEAKER_00 25:49

Yeah. What did you say?

SPEAKER_03 25:51

I don't know anymore.

SPEAKER_00 25:52

I don't know, but it was it was very deep. I didn't know that.

SPEAKER_03 25:56

I don't think he would have been a hero if he if he'd hadn't done the things he did, he wouldn't be a hero. Right. And the things he did were well, he did good things.

SPEAKER_00 26:05

He he did something. We don't know the guy, but and you know, you can't, you know, like uh uh the British Museum stole all those artifacts. That was a dick move. But because they stole all those artifacts, we still have those artificial rooms for people to enjoy.

SPEAKER_03 26:21

Everyone does dickish things. I've changed my mind. He's a hero.

SPEAKER_00 26:24

Uh I have not.

SPEAKER_03 26:25

I'm changing. Well, you know what he was like the Queen liked him. I thought you would Queen Victoria like them.

SPEAKER_00 26:30

Um I don't do everything the Queen tells me to do.

SPEAKER_03 26:34

All right.

SPEAKER_00 26:36

I understand. So tell me your fast five, you prepared person. You I made a very comprehensive list, I say bland list. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 26:48

Because I like bland.

SPEAKER_00 26:51

Give me bland.

SPEAKER_03 26:52

My fast five are birds.

SPEAKER_00 26:53

Birds. Oh, okay. I do have some opinions about birds, and some are dicks.

SPEAKER_03 26:58

And some of it is because my lovely daughter Jovi, who wants to be a call-in guest.

SPEAKER_00 27:03

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_03 27:04

Um, but couldn't today because she's at school. Oh well. So we're gonna have to figure something out. But uh, she sent me a video. I'll go through but oh here's the first one on my life.

SPEAKER_00 27:15

Okay. Cuckoo bird. I'm gonna say hero.

SPEAKER_03 27:18

Okay. Turkeys.

SPEAKER_00 27:20

Uh I'm gonna say delicious hero.

SPEAKER_03 27:23

Hummingbird.

SPEAKER_00 27:25

Um They're they're a hero. They're so small, they're fighting, fighting all the time.

SPEAKER_03 27:31

Seagulls.

SPEAKER_00 27:33

Gotta go dick on that one.

SPEAKER_03 27:34

Pigeons.

SPEAKER_00 27:36

You know, they're they could go either way because they can be really annoying. But for the most part, I like them.

SPEAKER_02 27:44

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 27:45

So I'm gonna say hero. You know who's the biggest dick in the bird world bird world though?

SPEAKER_03 27:50

Greckle.

SPEAKER_00 27:51

Uh no, close second. Blue Jay. Blue Jay.

SPEAKER_03 27:54

Those mothers. They can imitate every animal and they're but they they just they're dicks. Yeah. They don't mean I'm blue and look at me, I'm blue. I'm so blue and pretty out of here. Just the noise. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 28:07

Like I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 28:08

If they'll see it, like I remember when I lived out there on the ridge, and I'd go for a nice walk in the woods, and they would see you and tell everybody else in the woods. They would not stop over and over, and then you shoot them with your BB gun.

SPEAKER_00 28:24

I didn't do that.

SPEAKER_03 28:25

No, you didn't do that. It sounds illegal.

SPEAKER_00 28:28

Cuckoo bird, I think they have uh some notorious past, though. Don't they steal nests or something?

SPEAKER_03 28:36

That's where it came from. Jovi sent me a video. She likes to do this, educate me about nature. And so there's this bird, I think it was a wren or something, and it comes to its nest, and there's three eggs in it. Well, two of the eggs are, you know, small to medium, but then one egg is a little bit bigger than the other two.

SPEAKER_02 28:55

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_03 28:56

Okay, so there's time lapse, and this bird keeps coming, and pretty soon the birds hatch. And the biggest one hatches first. And it's you know, this none of them are pretty grotesque looking thing. Yeah, not baby birds aren't great anyway.

SPEAKER_00 29:11

And so they're very prehistoric.

SPEAKER_03 29:12

What does it do? Gets its fat body in there, poop, kicks out one of the eggs, and then the other bird hatches and being pops that one out. And so it's the only one left. And this thing is growing so fast than the mama birds coming to feed it, you know, like she's gonna be able to do that. The rating I don't know where this kid came from. I guess it's not. I shouldn't have been messing around.

SPEAKER_00 29:32

This guy's pretty bad. So this told me he was a rat.

SPEAKER_03 29:35

It's shortly, it doesn't take long, it's way bigger than the mom, even. And it's feeding it, feeding it. Well, it turns out to be the cuckoo, cuckoo bird. So they go and drop an egg in a nest and let someone else raise the kid.

SPEAKER_00 29:46

And I was like, wow, that's that's dickish. That is dickish. That's horrible. But they got the name, cuckoo bird.

SPEAKER_03 29:53

Yeah. I just watched that. It was a great movie. Um, am I supposed to say mine? What I mean. You did all of them.

SPEAKER_00 30:00

No, I don't think so.

SPEAKER_03 30:01

No, we know because I think turkeys are dicks.

SPEAKER_00 30:04

But you don't think they're delicious heroes? I mean, they're stupid.

SPEAKER_03 30:10

I don't like them.

SPEAKER_00 30:11

They're really big. They're a lot bigger than you think.

SPEAKER_03 30:14

Seagulls, I respect the seagull. They're cleaning up the earth for us.

SPEAKER_00 30:18

They're always by my fries if you're on the beach.

SPEAKER_03 30:22

Do you throw the fries out? No.

unknown 30:23

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 30:24

No, and one time I was sitting waiting for someone in a parking lot, and um was I eating in the car? I might have been eating in the car, and a seagull came and sat on my roof.

SPEAKER_03 30:37

He's hungry.

SPEAKER_00 30:38

I could feel it. Tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, and I'm like, what am I gonna do? I can't open the door. He will kill me.

SPEAKER_03 30:44

It's not gonna kill you.

SPEAKER_00 30:46

Well, I didn't open the door and test that theory, did I?

SPEAKER_03 30:49

Jesus.

SPEAKER_00 30:50

So it was in the medical arts clinic. Mark came a lot, beeping the horn, beep beeping.

SPEAKER_03 30:55

You're beeping the horn.

SPEAKER_00 30:57

Birds was like, up you, out there.

SPEAKER_03 31:00

You got food? I'll leave when you feed me.

SPEAKER_00 31:03

Finally, somebody pulled up next to me and he took off.

SPEAKER_03 31:07

Huh.

SPEAKER_00 31:08

I think he was trying to carry my car away.

SPEAKER_03 31:10

Probably. What they need to do is train the seagulls to eat cuckoo bird babies.

SPEAKER_00 31:14

Maybe to eat their eggs.

SPEAKER_03 31:16

They don't eat live stuff.

SPEAKER_00 31:17

Did that seagull poop on my car too? I don't think he did, but I was positive he would have.

SPEAKER_03 31:22

Well, he would have done it after you gave him the French guy. Yeah, but take that, dummy.

SPEAKER_00 31:27

That beach.

SPEAKER_03 31:27

Uh, and then pigeons are heroes.

SPEAKER_00 31:31

Uh, I like pigeons, and here's why. We had a pigeon visit us from Canada. It was a homing pigeon. He lost his way.

SPEAKER_03 31:38

Come on.

SPEAKER_00 31:39

It is a true story.

SPEAKER_03 31:40

Wait a minute. He uh out at your house.

SPEAKER_00 31:43

Out at our house.

SPEAKER_03 31:44

So the pigeon just showed up on your door.

SPEAKER_00 31:45

Yeah, we and he really did. He was on our beach, and um uh my husband was in the yard doing some stuff. He's like, I felt like somebody was behind me. I turned around, there's this pigeon. Hello! And you could tell he was tame, you know. Yeah, and and we looked and he had a bracelet on. No, he had a bracelet up. So he just kind of hung out and we're like, well, he'll take off after a while. It was a Sunday. And we left and went to my in-laws for dinner, came back, you're sitting on our porch. Is it cool if I'm here? And we're like, all right. So we we had sunflower seeds, so we fed him some of those and put some water out, and he roosted on our light uh in our uh outdoor deck. He roosted there overnight, and uh I should have put a cloth down over our couch. I remember our couch was right under it, and he did go to the bathroom quite a lot on the couch, but whatever. I should have saw that coming. So um, yeah, he stayed for like three days, and then my um my niece-in-law took him home. She used to work in a zoo, and um, they had him for a little while. She took the band off, though, got his information, and his owner said, Oh, yeah, that's whatever. I can't remember his name. We called him Norm.

SPEAKER_03 33:03

Pierre would have been a good one.

SPEAKER_00 33:04

Well, we called him Norm because he we didn't know he was from Canada, but we called him Norm because the pigeon and um the cartoon with uh with the oh shoot, what's that guy's name? The boxer uh that has the face tattoo.

SPEAKER_03 33:23

Mike Tyson?

SPEAKER_00 33:24

Yes, he had a cartoon at the time, and Norm McDonald did a voice of a pigeon on it. And I love Norm McDonald, so we called him Norm, who is Canadian. Anyway, I think he's still Canadian, he's just dead. Yeah, he's still, yeah, I guess so. So uh he the owner said, just throw Norm up in the air and he'll fly home, and he made it home.

SPEAKER_03 33:46

How do you know he made it home? Did he call you?

SPEAKER_00 33:48

Uh he did he did not. We're just assuming he made it home because it'll happen. So that is the reason why I like pigeons.

SPEAKER_03 33:57

I like that a lot. That's fascinating.

SPEAKER_00 34:00

Yeah, he was. I wish we would have kept him, honestly.

SPEAKER_03 34:03

I'm thinking that we need to have another podcast that's not hero or deck.

SPEAKER_00 34:07

It's just norm.

SPEAKER_03 34:08

The pigeons. The norm, we'll call it. Hey. And we just talk about normal stuff.

SPEAKER_00 34:13

Uh-oh, okay.

SPEAKER_03 34:14

Well, maybe I will check the emails.

SPEAKER_00 34:16

So my fast five are just, I don't know, like kind of boring. One, two, three, four. Well, first of all, we only have four. So right there. You can throw another one. I cannot count. I see how you crossed a bunch of them out though. So uh what do you how about Burning Man, Hero or Dick? Dick. Yeah. Always or just this year? Always. Yes. Um, how about the Bermuda Triangle?

SPEAKER_03 34:38

Hero.

SPEAKER_00 34:39

Weeding people out?

SPEAKER_03 34:40

Yeah, yeah. Okay. Like, there's a reason it's happening. Yes. And if it takes me one day, I must have been something doing something. Yeah, yeah, it's your fault. Mine. Your fault. Maybe that's where it happened to Norm.

SPEAKER_00 34:49

Um, he's in Canada.

SPEAKER_03 34:51

Uh he went to Canada.

SPEAKER_00 34:54

Um, how about Golden Gram Cereal?

SPEAKER_02 34:58

Hero.

SPEAKER_00 34:59

Because Jason Bateman did a commercial for them in 1980.

SPEAKER_03 35:03

He did.

SPEAKER_00 35:04

He did. And they're a hero because of that. Actually, they're delicious. I love them.

SPEAKER_03 35:09

You know, though. They should stay crisp longer, don't you think?

SPEAKER_00 35:13

Well, there's gotta be technology for anything. It's like, don't put the milk on, don't put the milk on, don't put the milk on. Okay, put it on. Now eat, eat.

SPEAKER_03 35:20

A non-nutral, non- Oh god, how does Chevy Chase say it? A non-nutrient cereal varnish.

SPEAKER_00 35:26

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 35:28

Jason Bateman.

SPEAKER_00 35:29

Yeah, did a commercial for me. Oh, he could still do it. Holy shit.

SPEAKER_03 35:35

They should have him do the commercial again. You know how people do the remote pictures and stuff?

SPEAKER_00 35:41

Is Golden Gram still cereal though? Yes. Are they? Okay. Holy shit, are you kidding me right now?

SPEAKER_03 35:46

I almost bought a giant. I mean, Walmart, everything's big there now.

SPEAKER_00 35:50

Well, the boxes are big, but then you get the cereal's like eight.

SPEAKER_03 35:54

You like honeycomb?

SPEAKER_00 35:55

No, I do not.

SPEAKER_03 35:56

Well, that takes care of that. Um, anyway, Couples Retreat. I watched that again the other night.

SPEAKER_00 36:01

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_03 36:01

Jason Bateman.

SPEAKER_00 36:02

Is he eating honeycombs? Is there golden grams in it?

SPEAKER_03 36:05

No, he him and his wife can't reproduce.

SPEAKER_00 36:07

Oh.

SPEAKER_03 36:08

Did you see that movie?

SPEAKER_00 36:09

Maybe they need to eat more cereal.

SPEAKER_03 36:10

Golden grams.

SPEAKER_00 36:11

Maybe.

SPEAKER_03 36:12

Anyway, sorry.

SPEAKER_00 36:13

All right. Uh, okay, so number four is Alice Cooper.

SPEAKER_03 36:21

He's a hero.

SPEAKER_00 36:22

Yeah, I think so.

SPEAKER_03 36:23

He seems like a really nice guy, actually. Every time you talk, I don't talk to him. Every time I hear him talk.

SPEAKER_00 36:30

A nice guy.

SPEAKER_03 36:30

Marilyn Manson, though, I don't know about that.

SPEAKER_00 36:32

No, I'm gonna say no. Marilyn Manson.

SPEAKER_03 36:35

So your list, you just didn't know. I just did randoms.

SPEAKER_00 36:39

Random.

SPEAKER_03 36:39

Golden grams.

SPEAKER_00 36:40

Mm-hmm. Alice Cooper, Bermuda Triangle. Bermuda Triangle. I have one more.

SPEAKER_03 36:44

Do it.

SPEAKER_00 36:45

I do have one more. And we talked about this one before, but we said we were gonna revisit it. And it is Cocaine Bear.

SPEAKER_03 36:53

Oh, I didn't watch it yet.

SPEAKER_00 36:54

Okay, I guess we'll revisit it. Since I have You watched it. I yes. Since I have talked about it since it was first on a Fast Five, I've actually watched it and I highly recommend it. I heard it's a great weird, crazy movie. Yeah. Highly recommend it.

SPEAKER_03 37:15

Alright. I'm gonna watch it. Hey, sorry. I know we're going over on time, but have you watched Ted Lasso? Have we talked about that yet?

SPEAKER_00 37:23

No, I haven't, but I have it on my list, but I haven't watched it. I do love uh Jay No, not Jason. Yeah, is it Jason Sidakis? Yes.

SPEAKER_03 37:31

I do like it's annoying at first, this character.

SPEAKER_00 37:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 37:35

Actually, it's pretty annoying all the time, but he's a good guy. It's the first show I think I've ever watched in my life where everything is always turned back the positive. Positive, positive, positive.

SPEAKER_02 37:45

Okay. Well really.

SPEAKER_03 37:46

There's some dark shit in it too. In the episode that you're gonna love the most, I think, is like third season, episode six or something. I don't know what one is.

SPEAKER_00 37:56

And I think they just wrapped it up, too. There's no more seasons.

SPEAKER_03 37:59

There's none.

SPEAKER_00 38:00

Okay. Which is usually when I actually watch something.

SPEAKER_03 38:04

When?

SPEAKER_00 38:05

When I know there's an ending to it. You know, like it if all the things are. Oh, so you got something to shoot for. Right. So I don't want to start watching it and then go. I do. I do.

SPEAKER_03 38:18

My wife can do that too. Like I can watch it. Like, she's like, if we're starting something, we're gonna watch all of them. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:24

I think she would we Well it depends on what it is.

SPEAKER_03 38:26

I mean, if I don't like it, I'm not gonna How long do you wait before you're like no on something?

SPEAKER_00 38:31

Well, I think you have to give any show, especially a series show like that. I think you have to give it at least two episodes.

SPEAKER_03 38:41

You give it more?

SPEAKER_00 38:42

Oh yeah. Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_03 38:44

Okay. I'm a two of the three guys.

SPEAKER_00 38:45

Do the research on Seinfeld. Seinfeld's first season, bombed. Bombed. And and it depends. I mean, some people still say it bombed, you know, but I liked it in its day. I still I watched it again yesterday. You watch Elaine dance? You try not to laugh.

SPEAKER_03 39:02

I watched the um Um Mama the Junior Mint episode yesterday.

SPEAKER_00 39:08

How can you not? And there's so many quotes from that show that a pulp can move, baby.

SPEAKER_03 39:14

Nothing there's nothing wrong with that.

SPEAKER_00 39:18

All right. Vandalay Industries. I'll stay in Vandalay Industries. See, we're laughing.

SPEAKER_02 39:24

We are.

SPEAKER_00 39:24

But um but the first episode or the first season, I guess not.

SPEAKER_03 39:29

Well, yeah, because they tried to make it like Jerry's life. Right. And like he's always gonna be a little bit more than a little bit. Well it took a while to to get the wine there held out.

SPEAKER_00 39:37

Yeah, it took a while to get the king.

SPEAKER_03 39:38

I don't even think he's the I think he is a sub character, even though it was about him. I think the best people were like Elaine and Kramer.

SPEAKER_00 39:45

Yeah, but he was the glue. He was the rock. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 39:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 39:48

And now he's a gazillionaire.

SPEAKER_03 39:50

He is.

SPEAKER_00 39:51

So comedians and cars. Mm-hmm.

unknown 39:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 39:54

He had an awesome mullet in the day, too. He had a really nice mullet. All right. So Hero or Dick, one more time. And email us, people. Sorry. I mean, person who's listening. Yeah. Hero or Dick. Do you want to do that? Well, they could take a letter.

SPEAKER_03 40:10

They could write a letter.

SPEAKER_00 40:11

Do you have an address?

SPEAKER_03 40:12

Yeah, you can send it to 119 West Washington Avenue, Alpina, Michigan, 49707.

SPEAKER_00 40:20

Wow, I hope we get a letter. Yeah. That would be great. Even a letter that's like a ransom letter, that would be fine.

SPEAKER_03 40:27

As long as they're not taking something from us.

SPEAKER_00 40:29

Well, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 40:30

Ransom, maybe ransom to be on the show.

SPEAKER_00 40:33

Okay. Like, yeah, call us if you want to be on the show. Not call. That's the only option we didn't give.

SPEAKER_03 40:40

No, I don't want to talk to anybody.

SPEAKER_00 40:42

But you can email us or write us a letter if you want to be on the show, or if you have any topics, or if you have anything you want to get off your chest.

SPEAKER_03 40:50

You know what? I think I can have a phone number next time. All right. I have one.

SPEAKER_00 40:53

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 40:54

We'll have to look it up. My main one, but I have it's like a burner phone.

SPEAKER_00 40:57

Yeah, it is.

SPEAKER_03 41:00

All right.

SPEAKER_02 41:01

Thanks.

SPEAKER_00 41:01

All right. Thanks, person listening.

SPEAKER_03 41:03

Bye bye.